This is nothing new. Before the steam deck came out, Handheld PCs have already been
overpricedexpensive. Other manufacturers haven’t bothered about affordability before, during ot after the steam deck.That said, Gabe Newell said the steam deck was priced “painfully”, which means they probably had very low margins on the hardware and are making it back on sales on their store. Other manufacturers do not have that luxury.
Steam Deck hits a sweet spot. You can make it more powerful, but it’ll cost significantly more. You can make it cheaper, but you’ll cut out too many games people want to play.
Also, anything like this with a resolution higher than 720p is wasting pixels and GPU power, IMO.
I wouldnt call devices like the GPDwin overpriced considering it’s probably lower volume production and niche use case.
But they are overpriced in direct performance comparison.Other manufacturers do not have that luxury.
They can find some margin in using a rolling Arch distro instead of paying for Windows, Gabe helpfully provided the template that you can reuse.
Which if anything is other manufacturers benefiting from the R&D that Valve have done with Proton and just making it freely available to anyone.
I doubt Windows is the reason these are more expensive. Microsoft wants Windows in the handheld PC space, so they are likely to provide licenses for free and likely help subsidize the costs a bit, especially if they include trials for gamepass.
Except that Windows versions of the same handheld are more expensive.
I am not aware that you are able to use SteamOS on anything that isnt an AMD CPU and GPU (only APU?).
If it’s not yet generally available for any hardware combination it would be very tempting to switch.
Already used the desktop of the deck quite a bit to customize some behaviour (automatic start of syncthing after (game-mode) boot to sync save states to my PC, EmuDeck, emulators in general)deleted by creator
Valve can easily sell Steam Decks with $0 profit. Can’t say the same for other OEMs.
But we’re not taking about other handhelds being 25 bucks more, or 50, or 75, or even 100 more, no, we’re taking about being multiple hundreds more
I mean, I don’t know valve’s margins but strategically they could sell steam decks at a loss and still come out ahead.
I believe some youtubers mentioned (maybe Tyler McVicker or some other in the space) that they are razor sharp margins and border on being profitable just like a console manufacturer.
If only there was something to be done to slash the price while not losing anything important like using an OS that is FREE… But alas, there’s no such thing, I guess we’ll have to stick with windows, adding the license price to a hardware that is already expensive…
Who supports that?
At least Windows is only one plattform in comparison to the bazillion linux-distros.Same issue devs face with consoles vs PCs.
Tell me you know don’t jack about linux without telling me you don’t know jack about linux in 25 words or less.
Well then: Clear it up.
I run headless debian VMs at home on a proxmox HV and another NUC with Debian that does Docker tasks.
My steckdeck runs the stock OS and am not scared to tinker within it.Never assumed to be a pro and would consider an amateur at best that isnt scared to tinker.
It’s just that I prefer convenience most of the time.So then. These are my cards. Explain what I learned wrong about the fractured linux ecosystem.
So far I know that Arch, Debian and RHEL the biggest distro families are.Edit: Very helpful. Downvoting instead of telling me where I am wrong.
(Yes my comment was provocative but @AbsolutelyNotAVelociraptor@sh.itjust.works should just tell where I am wrong if they are so sure of themselve).
Technically the OS isn’t free: Valve pays a team of developers to maintain the SteamOS and also donates money to Arch and Ubuntu foundations as well as to the Proton and Wine dev teams as well as contributes code to the linux kernel. All costing them money, that they eat but could easily find a way to charge the end user
Technically the OS isn’t free
And practically, that doesn’t matter. Valve isn’t charging anyone a licensing fee for the software they’ve developed, so as far as the cost of the device goes SteamOS is free. Just because they could charge for it doesn’t change that.
All it would take is for GabeN to die and a corporate takeover for Valve to change their tune. They are a corporation pursuing profit, not some fucking benevolent NGO, so stop idolizing them.
If GabeN is any sort of decent leader, he should be planning for retirement/death/etc.
A basic lesson of leadership is to start training your replacement ASAP and ensuring that things will run smoothly without you.
A lot of it is FOSS so no, they can’t take it back even if GabeN dies and a hostile takeover happens. They can stop giving out updates, which would be disappointing but far from the end of it.
They might not be benevolent, they’re still a major breath of fresh air compared to basically every other gaming company out there.
Any device that come with SteamOS by default, is a device that doesn’t come with both Windows and Xbox game store by default. Basically Valve isn’t paying for the OS, it’s paying for devices that run Steam Store by default (instead direct, unfair, competition from Microsoft)
Can Windows PC come by default with Steam Store? Of course… if Microsoft allow them to.
Do you pay to download it?
Do you need to pay for a license to use it?If not, it’s free.
Tip: (F)OSS aint free. The devs working on those programs also donate their time to the project
I mean… bazzite? ChimeraOS? You don’t need to go to steamOS to find a free linux distro that works well with games. Hell, you could even customize one based on any of those so you don’t have to pay for a windows license for your products.
Both of those heavily rely on Wine and especially Proton, which is funded by significant donations from Valve software, so you are arguing a trivial cost versus a subsidized cost.
Every other company is free to sponsor FOSS development too. You’re saying that like Microsoft and Windows aren’t already a defacto monopoly. Charge a FOSS contribution fee instead of the Windows license, done, Linux development sponsored by the manufacturers is solved and they too get to not get steamrolled by Microsoft.
So, instead of paying to license widows in your device, pay to support a system that ditches windows so you can stop relying on it and reduce costs of your products?
Steam has the steam store to recoup this cost. This is the same model MS and Sony follows to sell the hardware at or below mfg price.
But MSI, Asus and others don’t have their own platform, so they have to sell for more to maintain their bottom line.
If they ditch windows, their products can cost less without reducing profits, selling more units because of reduced price.
There is no reason for them to go with windows instead of linux if in neither case they are profitting from the OS.
Not only that, Windows machines need more raw CPU power to account for the increased overhead compared to Linux
I mean there will be customers for those products, I just don’t get why they’re leaving the mass appeal demographic on the table
Sell 15K units at 900 a pop, or sell 150K units at 500 a pop…
We don’t know the margins on these things but I’d think that higher volume sales would be better. But what do I know.
I suspect they don’t have the means to produce higher volumes, or aren’t willing to take that risk
Nintendo can make sure their handheld has affordable hardware yet can play all their AAA games as they were meant to. Steam Deck can’t ever have that luxury. Some Steam Deck makers will make expensive ones that can play most of them, some will make cheaper ones that aren’t made for those games at all.
This is very difficult to explain to the casual buyer (think parents buying as a present for their kids).
why cant valve optimise their new games specifically for their hardware? why is that impossible?
It’s not theirs?
I’m not sure most parents would be buying a handheld pc as a present for their kids. That’s a very expensive present to give a kid that could smash it on the ground or forget somewhere easily.
You have strange opinions regarding kids. Compare the price to a mobile phone.
/father of three
All the kids i know either have hand-me-down phones or new phones that’re at most mid-range or multiple generations old. I.E. the large majority of kids aren’t using 900 dollar phones
OK? Give it a couple more years and I bet you’ll start seeing that with handheld PC’s too
I’m not sure I follow. I have strange opinions about kids because I don’t think you should give a kid a 900€ phone/handheld when alternatives under 200€ exist?
I’m glad you can (and want to) buy a 900€ device for each of your 3 children, but I’m not sure how connected to the reality you are if you think that’s the norm.
The norm where? European middle-class, absolutely.
If you think that giving a kid a 900€ phone when there’s a much cheaper alternative that does the same is/should be the norm, you are part of a problem called consumerism.
What’s a valid reason to buy an expensive phone to a kid when a much cheaper alternative can do the same?
I think part of the issue here is that you believe that phones that cost 900 EUR really don’t offer anything cheaper alternatives don’t.
So answer me: what’s a feature that a kid needs and you won’t find in a cheaper phone?
Guy, this is Lemmy where the concept of a happy middle class EU/American is simply a lie that doesn’t exist.
Man, I just bought a refurbished Pixel 7 for $160 for myself. If you think I’m buying a $400+ Steam Deck – let alone some other handheld PC that’s even more expensive – for my kids, you’re outta your damn mind!
Why would that be concerning? Let the market find the right price point.
Because that works so well…
Yeah, like the House market /s
I wouldn’t compare a Steam Deck with living accommodations, but ok.
I don’t. I’m just telling another example of the ‘free’ market.
